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» One Touch Football - Archive » World Cup » I know what you're at, (Page 4)

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Author Topic: I know what you're at,
Gangster Octopus
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"w" is a vowel? Ah, so that explains cwm.
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noj
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So Wrexham starts with a vowel?
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VTTBoscombe
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Did Freeze do an extended version of "A E I O U" in Wales?
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noj
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Sorry, I guess that should be Wrecsam.
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Jorge Porbillas
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Yes, Wrecsam starts with a vowel.

H is also treated as a vowel sometimes too - just to confuse things

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The Batebe of Toro Foundation
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The whole vowels/consonants distinction is less clearcut than we usually assume, anyway, isn't it?
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thom
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No. Vowels are made with an open vocal tract; the different sounds are produced by changing the location of the tongue, but still keeping the track relatively open. Consonants, on the other hand, are made by using the tongue to form a blockage of some sort. This might be a total blockage, followed by a release (in sounds like /p/ and /d/), an extreme narrowing of the track to make the air fluctuate (e.g. /s/ and /r/) or some other way (/l/, for example, is made by blocking the centre of the vocal tract and making the air flow around the tongue).

In theory, you could have a sound part way between a given vowel and a given consonant. But few such sounds exist. Indeed, there's good reasons to think that sounds are maximally perceptually distinct given the constraints they are produced under, and that maximal distinctness is reflected in how the sounds are made. This means that sounds that fall part way between a consonant and a vowel don't actually appear in natural language (or if they do, they're very rare).

[ 18.08.2006, 16:28: Message edited by: thom ]

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noj
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Crikey. It's going to take me a while to digest that.
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The Batebe of Toro Foundation
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The key word there is "relatively", though, thom. The distinction is at best one of quantity, rather than quality. So "vowel" and "consonant" name conceptual categories, rather than "natural kinds"; they are points on a continuum which we differentiate (for all sorts of important reasons, don't get me wrong), rather than wholly different sorts of thing.
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thom
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Sure. But the sounds that two phoneticians might classify differentely don't actually exist in the real world. We can describe how they might be made, and some rare talented individuals might be able to actually make them. But they don't arise in any natural language.

So any sound that a speaker produces under normal circumstances should be easily classiafiable as vowel or consonant.

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The Batebe of Toro Foundation
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Well, fair enough.
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what's his name, the number 10....
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You can finish your conversation outside lads. Have you no homes to go to?

<continues sweeping>

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The Batebe of Toro Foundation
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It's fine, #10, I'll finish it in the morning before Francie gets in.


[/stagshead]

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noj
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No chance of a last cheeky one number 10?
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The Batebe of Toro Foundation
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Nah, stingy bastard that one.
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