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Author Topic: '"Overcome" Homosexuality'
mr smith
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Please forgive me oh great Y YoSoy El Toro but i was just trying to make a point. Why would anyone want to join an organization (or those who run it) that clearly hate them ? Agreed my question does'nt go into the deep theological questions but i'm just a thicky. I'll leave the realy clever stuff for you in your ivory tower.
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Ginger Yellow
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My whole point is that churches aren't like golf clubs. If they were, acts of defiance would be worthwhile, or at least meaningful. But we're talking about beliefs here. What is the point of "defying" a church that thinks you're going to hell? If you think it's theologically right, even though it condemns you to hell for your sexuality, then a) you've got a weird idea of "right", and b) take the theology and tell the church to fuck off.
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The Batebe of Toro Foundation
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SSS - whatever

Mr. Smith - If you have anything useful to say at all, rather than popping up out of nowhere and making pointless and/or inflammatory additions to the religion threads, might I kindly suggest you do so?

if you do not, might I less kindly suggest you fuck off and stop wasting people's time.

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The Batebe of Toro Foundation
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GY - I've drawn the distinction between having the correct theology, which includes continuity of tradition, and being mistaken on particular issues. So in response to your (a), it's not a weird notion at all. the righeness and the mistake pertain to entirely different things. In response to your (b) since the continuity of tradition is an intrinsic part of the theology, that's not a satisfactory (or, truth be told, coherent) option.
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TonTon
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quote:
Straight / Gay / Bisexual are all terms better suited to describing activity than to describe anything especially intrinsic, I reckon.
Yes indeedy, that's spot on as far as I'm concerned.
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G-Man
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I'm in a rush, so I'll just float a couple of baloons.

Membership of the RCC, I suppose, is partly a matter of continuity for cradle Catholics who have not rejected Christianity. I don't think, to be honest, that if I was homosexual I'd feel at ease converting to Catholocism.

Having said that, I should think that most Catholics see the myriad teachings for what they essentially are: a set of moral guidelines. Much more central to the Catholic life is its sacramental and salvific mission. I imagine it is that, not the Church's moral teachings, that provide the main consideration.

Frankly, if it was just a question of teachings and policies (and if my understanding of the nature and workings of the Church was less formed than it is), I would find it very difficult remaining a Catholic.

Anyway, all this was written in a rush, and not as carefully considered or articulated as it perhaps should have been.

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Super Sharp Shooter
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quote:
Frankly, if it was just a question of teachings and policies (and if my understanding of the nature and workings of the Church was less formed than it is), I would find it very difficult remaining a Catholic.
Change "understanding of" for "investement in" and you have my view of you and the substance of your faith in near-totality.

The monumental and absurdly caveated processes you have to go through to convince yourself its not just a load of wind must take some serious energy. It is, in an odd way, impressive.

[ 30.11.2005, 20:32: Message edited by: Super Sharp Shooter ]

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mr smith
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Telling some one to fuck off. Is that a useful, witty,intelligent thing to say. As i say im just a bit of a thicky enlighten me please.
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G-Man
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Witty? No. Intelligent? Perhaps not. Useful? Oh yes, sometimes it is.

It's the OTF way, telling people to fuck off. It's what we do. We are also quite happy to gratuitously insult each in quite disgusting ways, and if we really get mad, we are prone to slandering each others' good character. Welcome to OTF, mr smith.

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ad hoc
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Why are you attacking mr smith for asking a perfectly reasonable question Toro? Seems a tad unfriendly towards a new poster (and I speak as someone who has, in the past, been unfriendly to new posters, and in most cases regretted it - ie with Your Wives).

To give you a better (or at least my) response mr smith:
" why [would] any self respecting Gay, Lesbian or Bisexual person ... want to join, or be a member of, the Catholic Church?"

I imagine most homosexuals in the church joined before they were really sure about their sexuality (or indeed because of their confsion about it), while those who joined as adults do so as a kind of attempt to deny themselves (I know quite a lot of people with an alcohol problem take jobs in Saudi Arabia, for example)

[Edit: I have just encountered mr smith's contributions on the Rufus Wainwright thread and may have spoken too soon]

[ 01.12.2005, 08:01: Message edited by: ad hoc ]

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G-Man
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ad hoc, the question is indeed reasonable.

As toro has already suggested, mr smith's question following a gratuitous, illiterate and not particularly bright dig on the other catholic thread. mr smith's question was posed to insult, not out of genuine interest.

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Super Sharp Shooter
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Insult who, exactly? Surely it was largely rhetorical.
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G-Man
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If it was rhetorical it required no reply and toro was right to decline an answer either way.

[ 01.12.2005, 09:30: Message edited by: G-Man ]

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Super Sharp Shooter
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's actually very hostile to new posters, this board. I think that's a bit miserable, personally. Andf especialle when the topic is your's and toro's stupid twatty "faith". Take it on the chin, won't you.

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G-Man
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No, this board is very hostile to new posters who talk shit.
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